Gun discussion

[Meliva]

Decided to open up this thread so PK's wouldn't continue to get derailed. Now in response to the last thing Dez said

If the government were the only ones to have weapons, what would prevent them from ruling as tyrants. An armed civilian population is a counter to a government becoming tyrannical. The 2nd Amendment exists for 2 reasons, the formation of a militia and as a check to tyranny.


Buying bribes is the ultimate oxymoron. (using the traditional meaning of the word)

I highly doubt the amount of gun owners in the US, would be sufficient to stand against the US military. As for preventing government tyranny the US has other checks and balances to help prevent that from happening. Not to mention those in the military might have issues if the government ended up becoming tyrannical.

Also yeah, buying bribes is a rather big oxymoron.

[sXs]

Just as quick point of reference. According to FBI statistics, there are 25 million legal privately owned firearms in the state of Texas alone. But Deez is correct. The second amendmaent was put in place to prevent a tyrannical government from taking away all of our inherent rights.

A bit of a History lesson on how to control a population.

#1 Take away their firearms.
#2 Take away their right to free speech.
#3 Control their Healthcare.

Now if anyone can tell me where this came from I have a little prize for you.

"

[Sebena]

Just as quick point of reference. According to FBI statistics, there are 25 million legal privately owned firearms in the state of Texas alone. But Deez is correct. The second amendmaent was put in place to prevent a tyrannical government from taking away all of our inherent rights.

A bit of a History lesson on how to control a population.

#1 Take away their firearms.
#2 Take away their right to free speech.
#3 Control their Healthcare.

Now if anyone can tell me where this came from I have a little prize for you.

"

this is something that Nazis did to be precise it was Gestapo who closed gun clubs and arrested thir leaders.....

[Meliva]

Just as quick point of reference. According to FBI statistics, there are 25 million legal privately owned firearms in the state of Texas alone. But Deez is correct. The second amendmaent was put in place to prevent a tyrannical government from taking away all of our inherent rights.

A bit of a History lesson on how to control a population.

#1 Take away their firearms.
#2 Take away their right to free speech.
#3 Control their Healthcare.

Now if anyone can tell me where this came from I have a little prize for you.

"

What do you mean by where it came from? as in a country that did it first? if so my guess is north korea. Probably wrong but worth a shot. As for the 25M guns, after looking it up texas has a population of about 28M. Now of that 28M obviously a portion of that MUST be children, so that probably means some gun owners own multiple weapons. Also numbers alone wouldn't win a war- not every gun owner would be willing to fight, and not every gun owner would be capable. Those who are may not know any tactics- they would also need to organize quickly and set up some sort of leadership so it isn't just a bunch of rebels with no organization. Much easier to pick off targets when they are not working together properly.

[Most Lee Harmless]

Historically inaccurate claim : there never was widespread gun ownership in pre-Nazi Germany : firearm ownership was tightly controlled and very limited, in common with much of the rest of Europe at the time : in actuality, the Nazi's relaxed gun ownership laws to allow their own organisations and supporters to keep firearms.

Existing gun clubs were very much part of the social set of the upper and ruling classes which was a rather more pressing reason for their suppression, given the Nazi's initially presented themselves as a revolutionary working class movement.

An inconvenient truth which somewhat buggers up the theory stated above but never let the facts get in the way of a good conspiracy.

[Kangaroo]

Jim Jefferies argues the Australian POV quite well..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rR9IaXH1M0

[Stan Rogers]

Deznutz wrote-
"If the government were the only ones to have weapons, what would prevent them from ruling as tyrants. An armed civilian population is a counter to a government becoming tyrannical. The 2nd Amendment exists for 2 reasons, the formation of a militia and as a check to tyranny."

I am certain this was true 100 years ago however, today, I want to be on the side of those with Hell-fire missiles and Predator drones. I'll use my vote to help defeat the tyrannical who want me under their thumb. Unfortunately, I am not allowed to vote to who really runs the western ways of government. Eg: Corporations.

[Shadowood]

It is estimated that 55-65 million people own guns in america
There are 1.4 million active duty military personal in our armed forces

However, like Stan pointed out... I would want to be on the side with the people who have Drones and a lot bigger guns then I.

[Most Lee Harmless]

Resisting tyranny is a great line : who could argue with that? Until the 'tyranny' is actually defined, that is : After all, federal laws against segregation were deemed by many to be a 'tyrannical' abuse of states rights whilst for many of those being subjected to segregationist laws, the 'tyranny' lay elsewhere. One mans terrorist is another mans freedom-fighter is a sad truth. 'Hang Nelson Mandela' was a common enough statement in my youth, now he is a virtual saint. So, do you want armed anti-abortionists, or armed pro-choicers 'defending' themselves from 'tyranny' by imposing their view on you at gunpoint? Heck, I fear armed Beliebers rounding up non-beliebers for 're-education' too. Such an event would warrant fully automatic firearms in every household, but will you cheer when its your teenage daughter getting blown apart by them? Well, all very surreal and extreme, but its in such extremities that humor reveals harsh bitter truths : lacking some form of political and social mediation, we would be just as happy burning each other for worshipping the wrong god, or the right god, just in the wrong way, as much as for liking the wrong latest teen sensation, wearing the wrong clothes, having the wrong skin color, or a possessing a name spelt way funny. I'm not sure I fancy having some alt-right whacko defending me from 'tyranny' by imposing their own on me. I'm happy to say the same about the alt-left too. Fact is, humanity is way too fecking stupid en masse to be trusted with defining concepts like tyranny when even in 1940 entire sections of decent western democracy still thought Mr Hitler was a damn fine fellow and really had much to teach us all. Even more worrying is when there are serried ranks of fine up-standing freedom lovers who still think he was just mis-understood. No, governmental control of arms is not ideal, its not perfect, its not even constitutional in some places : but its a bit more reassuring than having the Armed Revolutionary Commie Caucus, or the Pure White Angelical Liberation Army save my soul by, well, helping me to realise they hold the eternal truth regarding what tyranny, and whats not.

[DezNutz]

Historically inaccurate claim : there never was widespread gun ownership in pre-Nazi Germany : firearm ownership was tightly controlled and very limited, in common with much of the rest of Europe at the time : in actuality, the Nazi's relaxed gun ownership laws to allow their own organisations and supporters to keep firearms.

Existing gun clubs were very much part of the social set of the upper and ruling classes which was a rather more pressing reason for their suppression, given the Nazi's initially presented themselves as a revolutionary working class movement.

An inconvenient truth which somewhat buggers up the theory stated above but never let the facts get in the way of a good conspiracy.

Danik is correct. Germany post The Great War (WWI) eliminated private gun ownership as part of the Treaty of Versailles. Over the years things changed and private gun ownership required a special permit. This was removed by the Nazis just prior to the start of WWII, but the private ownership of firearms was very small.